Malaysia signed deal for UK made SAMs

SHAH ALAM: Malaysia has signed the deal for the procurement of UK-made, Thales Starstreak V-Shorads, ahead of the official visit of the British Prime Minister on Thursday.

Industry sources told Malaysian Defence that the deal involved Global Komited Sdn Bhd which will supply the GM-M1 vehicles and Thales UK, the producer of the Starstreak V-Shorads. The deal will also include light weight multiple launchers, radars and command and control system.

A Weststar GK-M1 Weapon Platform fitted with Thales Starstreak launcher. The picture was first published in Weststar in mid-2014 probably during the firing trials. Weststar photo

The deal is reportedly worth around RM500 million though numbers of missiles and launchers procured are unknown.

Another angle of the GK-M1 with the Thales Starstreak platform showing the three missile launchers.

Global Komited, a subsidiary of Weststar Group and Thales signed the agreement to market the Starstreak system to the Malaysian Armed Forces at DSA 2014.

The Starstreak will replace the Thales Starbust V-Shorads which had been used in the air defence of military bases. GAPU requirements for a similar system and MR-SAM, however, have yet to be fulfilled.

As the signing today is for the LOA, the LOI for the deal would have been signed much earlier but was kept under wraps until today.
David Cameron, the UK PM will be in Kuala Lumpur Thursday for a 12 hour visit, the last leg of his South East Asia tour and the first to the region since his recent re-election.

Weststar Instagram page confirming the Starstreak deal

The Starstreak deal is the only defence item procured during the visit. As of Aug 2, no official announcement of the deal have yet to be made by the parties involved in the deal apart from an Instagram photo and caption published by Weststar Group (above).
.

–Malaysian Defence

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49 Responses to "Malaysia signed deal for UK made SAMs"

Michael says:

July 29, 2015 at 10:33 pm

woow..surprise deal… i expect this deall will happen earlier during Tun M / Tun B times but it never…

any idea the quantity? just for ATM? how about RMAF and RMN?

Reply
As mentioned it will be for military bases, most of those are with RMN and RMAF
Nihd says:

July 30, 2015 at 1:55 am

I hope that the government will but the mbda camm-er missile for lcs and medium-range sam requirement. Have a common missile will reduce the operating cost in the armed forces. Just my sekupang. Rather than choosing between the short range vl-mica and the essm that can only be used by ships.

And anyone had ever read about a russian missile being used with thales radars in an export variant of a russian ship?
M.F.J says:

July 30, 2015 at 4:20 am

How much we spend for the starstreak system Mr. Marhalim? Why don’t we just buy the jernas system, The Army already operated the jernas,Or why don’t we buy another system like Bamsee from sweden or crotale NG from france..more longer range compared to starstreak system if im not mistaken.
Just my 2 cents.
Azlan says:

July 30, 2015 at 4:27 am

Finally.

Now the 2 RMAF and RMN units that stood down when Starburst was retired can find purpose again. The deal for Starburst involved some 48 LMLs; wonder how many we bought this time around.

The bad news is that beam riders are more expensive than IR missiles, harder to gain proficiency and require crews to have more training but the good news is that until today, the majority of aircraft out there are not equipped to deal with beam riders.

I’ve always felt that instead of going for 54 Ingwe AV-8 variants that we should have halved it and also ordered a AD AV-8 variant with a Starstreak launcher and alerting device. Not sure how true it is but I’ve been told that the IR alerting device does not get along with our humidity.
Radin says:

July 30, 2015 at 7:22 am

It’s already 30 July 2015…… no news about 30mm AV8 Gempita. But it’s okay, i don’t blame the government for delay deliver the 30mm AV8. Anyway, i hope those Interpol and Investigator squad quick find that missing RM42 billion.
Lee Yoke Meng says:

July 30, 2015 at 12:08 pm

Not connected. It was printed in the latest air international magazine that the rmaf chief announced that our mrca programme is dead. Instead the migs will be upgraded with new radars , digital avionics n airframe will be upgraded to 6000 flying hours from the current 4000.

Reply
Must be a redo of the NST story..
TomTom says:

July 30, 2015 at 1:51 pm

All this confusion about the MRCA is surely not good for our reputation. One minute Rafale, then the next Migs to be upgraded.
Ridiculous!

Reply
If you want to believe those stories of course..
TomTom says:

July 30, 2015 at 3:22 pm

No, it not a question of wanting to believe or not.

Lack of reliable information leads to rumours and speculation, so an honest clarification is what is really needed.
anon says:

July 30, 2015 at 4:34 pm

Hope its not just the LML, but something like RapidRenger with auto cueing from radar.
... says:

July 30, 2015 at 5:42 pm

I have tried the starburst simulator. The missile recoil during the simulated launch was very realistic. Yes it was very2 difficult to track the target with a tiny toggle with your thumb. And it all lasts for about 5 seconds. It is only viable for targets heading directly towards or away from you. Nearly useless against targets crossing in front of your face.
Azlan says:

July 30, 2015 at 6:57 pm

Michael,

There was simply no need to buy
Starstreak during Mahathir and Badawi’s time as Starburst still had left in it. Also, for the first few years, Starstreak was only available to NATO countries.

MFJ,

The army doesn’t not want anymore Jernas. Not so much due to the system per say but other issues : Marhalim has commented on this before. There is a requirement for a middle range system but where is the money? A middle range system and it’s supporting gear will obviously cost much more than a MANPADS/V-SHORAD and can’t be bought in the same quantity.

Starstreak is intended to replace Starburst in all 3 services and it also needed as Igla and Anza will probably need replacing soon. A missile if stored in the right conditions will last about 10 years and the circuitry, battery and propellant can be work on but after that it has to be replaced.
Nihd says:

July 30, 2015 at 8:48 pm

i think it is the LML coz the weststar gm-k1 is just a light vehicle, smaller than the spanish uro vamtac.
nimitz says:

July 31, 2015 at 12:19 am

Thailand and Indonesia military are Starstreak operators in SEA too. Indonesia paid over £100M for 5 batteries of launchers,ControlMaster200 radars,C&C,LMLs on Landies and RapidRangers on Uro Vamtacs. (From Wiki)

IMHO maybe we signed up around that amount of £££, which is equal to RM 600M.

Reply
It’s slightly cheaper than that probably because of the Weststar trucks which also might meant no Rapid Ranger turrets.
M.F.J says:

July 31, 2015 at 12:43 am

Mr. Azlan,

Thank you for enlighten me about the jernas system issue. Btw, its pity when u said the army didn’t want jernas system anymore..i thought there is no issue about that system. Medium / middle ranged system?? In my head only think about BUK OR HAWK SAM (dreaming). But of course..no money no talk, since our g’ment allocated small budget for the defense.

Hope the ATM get what their needed with the small budget. So in the end, this starstreak system just a replacement for the older system starbus. I hope that we buy it with enough quantity for the 3 services.

just my 2 cents
ForcesReviewUK says:

July 31, 2015 at 11:23 am

It’s a nice deal given all the money and political problems for Malaysia. Getting CAMM-L or CAMM-N would be better, but that’s just to far away.
stanman says:

July 31, 2015 at 12:34 pm

Seriously? You want to buy Buk? When the Russians vetoed the MH17 tribunal?
Azlan says:

July 31, 2015 at 6:10 pm

M.F.J.

Until the MH17 issue is resolved, the only things of a military nature we’ll be buying from Russia is spares.

It might interest you to know that in the 2000-2003 period, Buk was offered to GAPU. It was not cheap [when compared to Western equivalents] and would have had to be integrated.
Johnrambo says:

July 31, 2015 at 6:13 pm

Well done business. But we need to look on spaag business to ensure our armoured cavalry well protected from anti tank heli which is now trending in asean. Otherwise, the pt91m is a sitting duck! Enough with manpads. Something like tunguska is what we should look at
Michael says:

July 31, 2015 at 10:39 pm

off topic…

can modern navy vessel face the war alone without air force? example like our 6 Gowind, can they face alone with 3 dimension treat without RMAF? like world war II Yamato destroyer, it go out to sea without any air cover..
the navy also know this will be their last trip when they order go to save Okinawa…
nimitz says:

August 1, 2015 at 12:15 am

GM-K1, this 4×4 is based on what chassis? Is it a “militarised” Toyota Hilux? As Marhalim said that it could be slightly cheaper than £100M, so I speculate that we will get LML for GM-K1, no Rapid Ranger. A better buy compared with Starburst as the new missiles will come with its own radar and C&C. The big questions remained ?? How many units and for how much million RM?

Reply
I believe Azlan said they got 48 Starburst in the past so it’s likely to be around that or just slightly more
I am told the cost is around RM500 million, so it will be RM10 million per launcher (together with the cost of all the equipment including radar etc)
nimitz says:

August 1, 2015 at 2:08 am

There are plans to raise a new Bde for 1 Infantry Div which would make the Div return to full complement of 3 Bdes. Neither Marine Bde nor Mech Bde but a Border Bde. The 31 Border Bde HQ will be in Bintulu (yeah the secondary jungle land had been gazetted for an Army camp for at least 10 years now, located along Pan Borneo Trunk Road not far from Bintulu Town) while its 5 Battalions each stationed in Kuching, Sibu, Bintulu, Miri and Lawas. IMHO only Bintulu is the odd one out as the frontier is at least 300km away, much better put a Bn in Kapit which is much closer and lesser flight time to the mountaineous border region. Rumours of Rat Routes are increasing along Sarawak-Kalimantan border due to logging,estate plantation and hydro resevoir had reached the once inaccessible mountain ridges jungle border.

http://www.theborneopost.com/2015/08/01/plan-underway-to-set-up-new-border-brigade-under-first-infantry-division/
Wiseguy5616 says:

August 1, 2015 at 2:49 am

Definitely not a wise decision , buying Rhinemetall Oerlikon Millenium Gun would be the best in defending Air Bases & Naval Bases .

Read from Wikipedia – Javelin ( surface to air missile ) & Blowpipe ( missile )

Blowpipe was used by both sides during the Falklands War in 1982. With the targets being fast flying aircraft, flying low and using the ground to hide their approach, the Blowpipe operator had about 20 seconds to spot the target, align the unit and fire. Brigadier Julian Thompson compared using the weapon to “trying to shoot pheasants with a drainpipe”. The official report stated that, of the 95 missiles fired by the British, only 9 managed to destroy their targets and all of these were slow flying planes and helicopters.[3] A later report determined that only two kills could be attributed to Blowpipe: A British Harrier GR3 (XZ972) attacked by Argentine Army special forces (Commandos Company), and an Argentine Aermacchi MB-339 (0766 (4-A-114)) during the Battle of Goose Green.[4]

Blowpipe was found to be particularly ineffective when used to engage a crossing target or to chase a target moving rapidly away from the operator. The poor performance led to it being withdrawn from UK service. In 1986 some of the mothballed units were sent clandestinely to equip the Mujahideen fighting the Soviets in Afghanistan.[5] The system again proved ineffective,[6] and was eventually supplanted by the US Stinger missile. While Blowpipe was available on the international arms market and therefore its origins were open to speculation, the Stinger was restricted, which at the time indicated a more open acknowledgment of Western support for the Mujahideen. Blowpipe missile systems are still being found in weapon caches as recently as May 2012 in Afghanistan.[7]

The Canadian military took Blowpipe from storage to give some protection to their naval contribution to the 1991 Gulf war, although sheer age had degraded the weapons, and nine out of 27 missiles tested misfired in some way.[8]

Blowpipe saw more effective use in the Cenepa War of 1995 between Ecuador and Peru, where it was deployed mainly against Peruvian Mil Mi-17 and Mil Mi-18 helicopters.[9]

I can’t believe we are still buying this . The worst hits probability …..

Definitely wasting Tax Payer Money ….

Reply
while the buy is debatable comparing the Starstreak to the Blowpipe is completely wrong. Comparing the Starstreak to the latest Stinger and other like it is more honest. As Azlan had pointed out the main concern about the Starstreak as it is beam riding missile it needs to be guided into the target hence it needs highly trained operators
M.F.J says:

August 1, 2015 at 3:55 am

Mr. Stanman,

Yup..the russian vetoed the MH17 tribunal. I just read the news this morning.. why the russian doing that??
Supposedly their should support the tribunal..hurmm..something fishy bout that.

Mr. Azlan,

Yeah..i read that story in “perajurit”. Besides buk system, there are also another contenders systems like china ks – 1A, Aster 30 and u.s made sam. And then rumors about Iris – T..but in the end..rumors just keep as a rumors.

In my opinion, i think Malaysia should start develop the capability in this anti air warfare. Not just depending to RMAF fighters / interceptors. Need to allocate a bigger budget for defense. Just my 2 cents. Because in ASEAN we are lef far behind compare to singapore, myanmar, thailand & vietnam (others asean country i’m not so sure). Believe me, i would like to see our ATM Planning to counter this new type of warfare (air dominance). It is just using aircraft for intercept or maybe using aircraft + sam…i would like to study out country doctrine on this type of warfare.
Lkick says:

August 1, 2015 at 12:02 pm

MFJ,

Why would russian vetoed the resolution? The answer is simple, this is because russian representatives was not in comitee that drafted the resolution along with Ukraine, holland, m’sia and Australia. So they believe that the resolution was bias and not in favour of them.

Reply
How does a resolution calling for a tribunal be biased. It is not like the resolution will set the terms of the tribunal
Ferret says:

August 1, 2015 at 1:07 pm

Wiseguy,

The Oerlikon looks like a good system but we’re talking about man-portable & vehicle mounted low level air defence for land/shore installations.

Nimitz,

Agree with your point about Rapid Ranger. Looks like target acquisition and tracking require highly trained operators. We’ve no experience with Starstreak yet. Maybe (hopefully) they’ll get Rapid later.

You have a point about the placements of the Border bns re Kapit. But of course there could be other factors involved in the camp sitings eg logistics & infrastructure such as roads etc. At any rate there’s nothing to stop the bn tac HQ from being deployed to Kapit.

The bigger question is, are we embarking on building a (land) border protection force? What is the PPH doing? Isn’t this a policing issue?
Anas says:

August 1, 2015 at 2:34 pm

Alas, it’s high time that the starburst to be replaced, though beam-riders are tough to master but i do think it is a good call as it is harder to jam and only allow very little response time, the only drawback is that the fuze is impact activated. With proper training and education i’m sure our boys could master this system. I would very thrilled to see a live-fire exercise once the system is acquired.

I don’t think going for more Jernas is a good choice, it is an expensive system that is soon to be replaced with better platform. The effective range is also not considerably better than starstreak.

M.F.J,

I don’t think we have the capital nor the expertise to develop our very own SAM. Developing a missile with its complementary systems is very difficult, expensive, and time consuming, just look at STRIDE with their Taming Sari. But we do have some expertise in surveillance system, and with the proliferation and development of cheap autonomous drones maybe we should try such endeavor. Besides, surveillance system is crucial for an integrated armed force and plays an important role both in time of crisis and peace.

Reply
We are not getting more Jernas for the simple reason that it’s no longer made. If it was hell will need to freeze first before they will buy a new batch
Azlan says:

August 1, 2015 at 6:58 pm

Wiseguy,

Both Javelin and Blowpipe are not only generations behind Starstreak but are no longer in service and haven’t been for a while: why even bother mentioning them? It’s as silly as saying that we should never buy Stinger as Redeye wasn’t effective or that we should never have bought Seawolf as Seacat wasn’t effective.

In line with its operational requirements, GAPU has a genuine need for MANPADs/V-SHORADs : it wasn’t intended to waste the taxpayer’s ringgit, rest assured. Also, if Starstreak wasn’t judged to be of any use, countries, including Britain, wouldn’t have bought it. As for your ”hits probability”: it all depends on the type of target. A slow moving helicopter – obviously – will be an easier target compared to a fast moving fighter that is flying low, maneuvering and is spewing out decoys.

There is no ideal solution, never has been and never will be.
MANPADs/V-SHORADs – in a ideal world – will operate in conjunction with longer range systems and alerting devices; all networked. There will be certain instances when a target is best engaged by a gun and instances where a target is best engaged by a missile. There is a reason why certain armies equip units with both Triple A and missiles.

M.F.J.

The first question you should ask is what are the threats currently facing us and the threats we are likely to face in the near future. Granted, anything can happen at short notice but the fact remains that chances of a full scale high intensity war involving state on state actors is almost nil and that the main threat we face comes from non-state actors; for which sexy stuff like fighters may not be the answer. A bit silly talking about ”air dominance” when one has a shortage of ISR assets to secure one’s coast and territorial waters.
stanman says:

August 1, 2015 at 7:27 pm

You must believe that the Luhansk And Donetsk People’s Republics have their weapons delivered by Santa Claus.
Azlan says:

August 1, 2015 at 8:20 pm

The need for Starstreak to be guided to its target is compensated by the fact that the operator won’t have to guide the missile for long; given its high speed of March 3/4.

A major advantage is that the bulk of aircraft are still not equipped to deal with beam riders : to be expected given that the bulk of MANPADS operated worldwide are IR guided ones. Yes, quite a number of aircraft are now fitted with a defensive aids suite but it’s one thing having a MAWS linked to a chaff and flare launcher and actually having a decoy to be used against beam riders. It might be worth mentioning that Soviet and now Russian doctrine; calls for 2-3 missiles to be fired to increase the probability of kill.
Azlan says:

August 1, 2015 at 8:28 pm

Wiseguy,

The Afghan resistance also got Strelas; courtesy of Egypt. The fact that Stinger accounted for the bulk of kills is not only because Stinger was way ahead in capabilities when compared to others but also because it was supplied in far greater numbers and the operators received much more thorough training than they did with Blowpipe and Strela.

At the end of the day, mention of Blowpipe and Javelin is irrelevant as both are completely different animals when compared to Starstreak and even Starburst.
nimitz says:

August 2, 2015 at 1:27 am

Currently Malaysia’s “land border protection force” or “border guard” is a joint TD-PDRM forces; Border Regiment and PPH (now Pasukan Gerakan Am). AFAIK Sarawak-Kalimantan border crossing points and posts are under military control. Combatant & Combat Support outfits deployed to the frontier posts on rotational basis, I know of a post which in a year, it changed hands between infantry/armour/arty/engineer units. I believe it’s better for these units prepare for war while border duty for a garrison outfit. PPH maybe lately more focus towards internal policing but not up to the border lines itself. But I can be wrong because judging from reports coming from Malaysia-Thai border, PGA-Army together garrison the border according to its allocated sectors.

Perhaps with more Border Battalions, sooner or later Army will be the only agency guarding the land border while PDRM restuctures its paramilitary forces into standard policing forces. To me, the best land border guard is a stand alone border guard agency ala Aus CBP and US Border Patrol.
Ferret says:

August 2, 2015 at 1:42 pm

Nimitz,

“I believe it’s better for these units prepare for war while border duty for a garrison outfit.”

“the best land border guard is a stand alone border guard agency ala Aus CBP and US Border Patrol.”

I’ll echo both.

If we look at govt media statements on border security, they’re all about illegal immigrants, smuggling, cross-border crime — things under the purview of the Home and Finance Ministries, not Mindef.

IIRC, handing over responsibility for Malaysia-Thai border to MAF met initial resistance from PDRM perhaps because providing law enforcement assistance in regards immigration, excise, etc is prescribed in the Police Act. Then it was agreed MAF take over Kedah-Kelantan sector. Then the mass graves incident occurred in the Perlis (PDRM) sector, for which the MAF received some unwarranted and unfair criticism. Now they want MAF to take over entirely a responsibility that is not primarily theirs.

Handing over the responsibilty may be seen as compliment to MAF by some people but I see a bit of a moral hazard for the MAF here. If other govt agencies, despite their hype, can’t do their jobs properly, not to worry, they’ll just have to hand over to MAF, problem solved. But I think the MAF has a job to do and shouldn’t be distracted from their primary role and tasks. Catching people- and rice smugglers is not one.

Yes, a stand-alone land border protection agency, perhaps under PM Dept like APMM, is what we need: immigration and customs officers backed by a bde or two of PPH. They can also have the border regt if they want. Only thing is, if the formation of MMEA is any guide, the govt’s got to manage the turf wars that’s bound to come up.
tomahawk says:

August 2, 2015 at 1:52 pm

Sg and My shld reali consider joint air defend like Norad. Range rings from SG Aster, Spyder, barak missile at sea and land oredi overlap West Msia. Aster 30 also has defend against medium range ballistic missile.

And if SG opt for Aster Block 2 or 45 for exo-atmospheric anti ballistic missile strike whole of West Msia can be cover from SG. This is likely progression for SG. Either that or Arrow or Thaad.
MILSPEC says:

August 2, 2015 at 2:10 pm

But still, remember that creating another stand alone agency to guard the border needs more money. Until we have the cash, we have to rely on the current forces to guard them.

After all, we are living on a Fantasy Land…
Ferret says:

August 2, 2015 at 4:28 pm

MILSPEC,

The MAF is going to raise 5 bn of Borderers for Sarawak, doesn’t that cost money?

Yes the new agency is going to cost money, but not that much. The main component of the cost, the personnel, is already budgeted for — UPP, PPH, Immigration, Border Regt, are already in place. They just need to be transferred to the new agency. Training is also in place, but in various ministries/depts so not much additional costs there. Perhaps the only additional cost will be for office space and extra equipment — comms, transport (although I don’t see why the tpt establishment of the various units can’t be transferred to the new agency), perhaps weapons.

“After all, we are living on a Fantasy Land…”

More like Blue Ocean Strategy Land. Fantasy Land is where you have the armed forces doing police duties and the police getting militarised, and expect both to do their real jobs well.
Azlan says:

August 2, 2015 at 6:53 pm

Tomahawk,

For Malaysia, getting an ABM or long range capability is not a priority. With Singapore it’s different as although Singapore is concerned about non-state threats, the focus is still on state threats.

Defence cooperation has improved but this will mainly be confined to the sharing of intel, cross training, behind the scenes cooperation, joint activities in keeping the Melaka Straits secure, etc. We have yet to reach a stage where both countries will coordinate their purchases; not only because the threat situation does not warrant it but mainly because both countries have different threat perceptions and priorities. There is however a mechanism for what you suggest : the FPDA. ATC radars from both countries are linked by fibre optic to HQIADS in Butterworth and the only assets actually assigned to HQIADS were the Bloodhound followed by the I-Hawks.

Even if cash was not an issue; Malaysia would be hard pressed to achieve the same level of layered AD capability as Singapore has over major population centres, military bases and other strategic locations, on account of being a very much larger country.
Fariz says:

August 2, 2015 at 9:59 pm

P.S. Increased Malaysia/Singapore defence cooperation will also take into account Indonesia : neither Malaysia nor Singapore will want to ”offend” the Indonesians or make them feel like they are seen as a threat as this would affect relations and not contribute to regional stability. As it is, Indonesia in the past has called for the FPDA to be done away with and replaced by a new defence arrangement which includes Indonesia.

Singapore’s concern about ABM defence is driven by the possibility that Indonesia might acquire ‘new’ gear in the future. Indonesia publicly announced that it was very interested in Scuds in the 1990’s and not too long ago, there were reports of Indonesia working, with the Chinese, on an extended range, land attack variant of the C-802.
Lee Yoke Meng says:

August 3, 2015 at 1:27 am

Actually, raising the new border batallions would not be very difficult or very expensive. Remember our border batallions in the thai ma border?. They were activated asjar wataniahs with extra trainning to make them operational. The same can n will be implemented in the east. What more, it gives employment to a lot of the youths n solve two problem with this method i.e defending the border n increases employment
tomahawk says:

August 3, 2015 at 1:31 am

@ Fariz

Not Indonesia. The current Aster 30 has anti-ballistic medium range capability which cater to such regional development. The ABM drive is for N.korea and China. It got to with SG lack of strategic depth and diplomacy clout. SG is in their range ring.

The FPDA was form to counter Indon. This is a fact. Do you really want to dismantle it or change it purpose?
kamal says:

August 3, 2015 at 10:57 am

I thnik nest step in ground based air defense, Malaysia should concentrate on the range between 10km to 20km first, if and when there is money. Few candidates for this such as VL MIca, Norwegian Ground based Amraam or even the chinese based FM90. lets take it slow and steady
stanman says:

August 3, 2015 at 1:36 pm

No. The unemployment problem in Malaysia will not be solved by the Government. It has entirely to do with Malaysians who are unwilling to work and have no skills thanks to the broken education system and a dependency mindset.
kamal says:

August 3, 2015 at 2:12 pm

Dear Stanman,

Whoa..strong words..last statistic showed that we have around 3.5% to 3.6% unemployement. In some countries that would be called full employment already. NO skills? which part of the divide are you talking about..agreed our education system can be very much better (with our comparative score in maths in science even worst than Vietnam) but totally broken hmmm i beg to differ, and yes graduate unemployment among the bumi is very high indeed, up to 30%-40% but sizeable number get jobs within 18 to 24 months later. There will always be mismatch with what our public uni produce and what the job markets want but the situation is not so severe..but then again you are very much entitled to your opinion
Azlan says:

August 3, 2015 at 3:23 pm

Tomahawk

I am keenly aware that the FPDA was formed as a hedge against Indonesia. If you read my post again, I never suggested we revamp it; merely mentioned what Indonesia mentioned about it publicly. My mention of Indonesia was to demonstrate that what you proposed will not become reality unless things get to a point where both countries start publicly calling Indonesia a “threat”.

I still maintain that ABM defence is centered more on Indonesia and any others in the region who may acquire a ballistic or cruise missile capability. It has less to do with Singapore’s zero strategic depth but with the need to stay one step ahead of its neighbours. Singapore will have remembered the talk of Scuds in the 1990’s and the possibility that a more prosperous Indonesia in the future might acquire new capabilities.

Sure, Singapore is in the “range ring” of Chinese missiles but so is the whole region and this has been the case for a while now. Also, if we reached a point where Chinese or North Korean missiles started flying our way, the Yanks will enter the picture. They might not if there is a short flare up involving 2 regional neighbours.

Kamal,

Given that the LCS will be armed with MICA, logic dictates that GAPU – if cash is ever available – also get MICA to lower the logistical footprint.
... says:

August 3, 2015 at 4:17 pm

Create more new battalions for border duties?

I would rather see existing infantry battalions from penisular rotated to the sarawak/sabah border area with maybe 6months long tour of duty for each battalion. In that way soldiers from throughout the army would familiarize themselves with the sarawak/sabah border area. No need for new battalions to be stood up. 3 battalions (2 in sarawak, 1 in sabah) for each 6 months rotational border tour of duty in addition to existing battalions in sarawak/sabah should be adequate.

And on the GBAD?
It is not the most pressing issue currently facing malaysian defence. The starstreak replacement of the obsolete starburst (if not mistaken the starstreak system has a lot in common with the starburst, the main difference is the supersonic missile with hardkill metal darts) is fine, but calls for additional GBAD systems would only be diverting the precious little budget away from more pressing issues and requirements.

Reply
The Army is planning two Border Regiments in Sabah and Sarawak as part of the plan to have one division each in East Malaysia. This will mean each division will have three brigades as explained in the Army Day interview.
Azlan says:

August 3, 2015 at 7:03 pm

One can argue that the next step would be for GAPU to get more gap fillers and alerting devices. At the moment all it has are the 2 TRS-3Ds, VERA and 2 (I’m assuming these are still in service?) Giraffes. The current threat environment just doesn’t justify spending for medium range systems; not when we have a pressing need for other less sexy stuff.

The good news is that we bought alerting devices for Starstreak so the regiment won’t have to rely on other GAPU assets. This would be the 2nd time we’ve bought a networked system, rather than a stand alone one.

Reply
The Giraffes are still in service AFAIK, not sure it will last RMK10 though…
Chua says:

August 3, 2015 at 8:18 pm

Azlan

And SG still focuses on Msia as the primary source of future conflict, though frankly I would think that Indi tends to be more volatile. Either way they will not co-operate especially since they are doing all the work and we just benefit.

If you look around, the Yanks are trying to get everyone to work together to oppose China… I wonder whether they even know about our Sulu problem, the level of their ignorance of regional politics.

Starstreak would seem to be excellent for anti-attack helicopter SAM. I don’t expect it to do much of anything else. Not against nations which have more fast jets than we have actual missiles.
Azlan says:

August 3, 2015 at 9:40 pm

Chua,

Off course Indonesia is the one to watch out for (there’s a whole list of unresolved issues, including maritime boundaries) but some fevered minded Malaysians will still keep harping on Singapore bring a “threat”; just like how some fevered minded Singaporeans will still keep harping on Malaysia.

Even if relations improve by a hundred fold, Singapore will still have contingency plans in place to deal with Malaysia and Indonesia (by virtue of both being larger and Muslim majority neighbours and Singapore having zero depth and sea lanes that are vulnerable).

Also, a strong and superior SAF not only makes PAP look good but is in line with the wishes of the island’s population, which has strong defence awareness.

The Yanks know well about the issues we face in Sabah and the complexities behind it. Senior Yank officials regularly visit Sabah and ESSCOM. We tried to get them to put pressure on Marcos in the past (over the Sabah issue) but they said it was an internal Malaysian/Philippines matter (didn’t stop them from interfering in the internal affairs of others off course) and the Philippines tried to get the Yanks to get the Brits to put pressure on us.

Starstreak is an excellent weapon against low flying jets, helicopters (the British army’s website makes mention of this) and UAVs. Like all weapons of its class, it’s a last ditch, point defence weapon to deal with leakers. Instead of asking whether we have enough missiles to deal with the number of jets potential opponents have; we should ask : in times of conflict, how many opportunities will Starstreak operators get to engage targets, how much early warning will they benefit from and whether the batteries will be in the right place at the right time?
baha says:

May 17, 2016 at 11:57 am

just another very short system but intended to defence the whole malaysia. The overall cost reach almost 1 billion but when talking about capability is questionable. What a system with maximum 8 km killing range can do? The air to ground weapon have advance so much with some latest weapon have at stand off range of more than 20 Nm not km. Today we are not tailing about engaging the platform but more of the ordnance. We can’t even see the aircraft because they will conduct long range targetting, way beyond the missile engagement zone (MEZ). we should get at least medium range if not the long range as what singapore did. Weapon should become deterrent to any potential adversary. Create fear not become laughing stock.
Azlan says:

May 18, 2016 at 3:20 am

baha – ”just another very short system but intended to defence the whole malaysia.”

It is not ” intended to defence the whole malaysia” but vital installations like HQs, supply dumps, etc.

baha – ”What a system with maximum 8 km killing range can do? ”

Aircraft won’t always be able to deliver ordnance at standoff ranges from high altitudes; due to many factors including the type of target, ROEs, weather, terrain, etc. MANPADS/V-SHORADS still have a role to play. If they didn’t, countries [including the U.S.] wouldn’t still be buying them. Going by your logic, there is no need for Triple A but many countries still see a valid need for Triple A.

Bala – ”we should get at least medium range if not the long range as what singapore did.”

MANPADS/V-SHORADS are intended to be part of an AD network comprising longer range systems. In our case the Starstreak in intended to replace the Starburst : a bit silly to buy a medium range system when the most numerous MANPADS/V-SHORADS [the Starstreak] has been retired and not replaced. Comparing us to Singapore is an apples to oranges comparison as the MAF and SAF are in different stages of development. Also, in case you haven’t noticed; despite having missiles with a longer range, the Singaporeans still operate MANPADS/V-SHORADS ….

Baha – ”Create fear not become laughing stock.”

It appears to only be a ”laughing stock” to you because you appear to have not done any research before hitting the keyboard or even taking the time to read and understand the previous discussions had on the subject.

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